An interview Sunday between CNN’s Jim Acosta and judge Philip Journey, who’s an NRA board member turned pretty feisty when Acosta asked all the right questions and just plain didn’t like it. He deflected Acosta’s questions at every turn.

Right from the beginning, Acosta noted the NRA has blocked “any new gun safety laws and pushed for the most relaxed rules possible on firearms. Isn’t some of this blood on the NRA’s hands?

After briefly thanking Acosta for inviting him on the show, Journey began elbowing the questions out of the way.

“I really don’t believe the supposition of your question is accurate. I know that while I’m not a spokesperson for anybody I follow the issue closely, and that the NRA and other organizations, even myself as a state Senator in Kansas have worked to tighten the laws. I think that it’s important to understand — “

Acosta wasn’t having any of it, so he jumped right in.

“No, no, no sir, I hope you understand that I’m going to have to cut you off when you start saying things that just aren’t true. The NRA has not worked to tighten rules, that’s just not the case. The NRA for years, for decades has pushed for the most relaxed rules possible in this country, and that’s why we have mass shooting after mass shooting. Please, if you could answer the question that I asked you at the beginning of the interview: Isn’t this blood on your hands?”

At that point, Journey was in deflect mode.

“I’m not the one that pulled the trigger and neither are the members of the National Rifle Association,” he said.

Referencing the Buffalo market shooting, Journey blamed officials there. “I think Buffalo is a great example, where the alarms were going off and all the officials in New York did was hit the ‘snooze’ button.”

He mentioned the shooter had “already threatened a mass shooting prior” and “nobody did anything.”

Journey has half a point there — but the point still remains that the NRA has helped turn this country into a shooting gallery. And done so with absolutely no remorse.

Uproxx notes at one point Acosta and Journey even argued over whether former president Donald Trump was dancing on stage during the NRA’s annual convention, which was held in Houston mere days after the tragic shooting that claimed more than 20 lives in Uvalde, Texas. Acosta took the opportunity to hammer Journey for holding a pro-gun event in the wake of the tragedy, especially since the event promoted an upbeat atmosphere. Acosta brought his point home and the fireworks began.

“Your group is holding its convention in Houston, where you are right now, just a few days after the massacre in Uvalde. We saw Donald Trump dancing on stage at the end of remarks,” he noted.

Journey responded:

“He was not! I was there; he was not dancing. Give me a break.”

Acosta, however, wasn’t going to give him a break.

“How is any of this at all appropriate? We’re showing [him] on stage right now. He’s doing a little jig there. People are waving their NRA hats and so on. It’s this celebratory atmosphere right after a mass shooting where all these kids are gunned down. How is that appropriate?”

Journey deflected. Again.

“I think that what you’re doing is just telling part of the story there. Because at the beginning of his speech, he did do a very memorable memorial for the victims.”

Here’s his “very memorable memorial” right here.

This is just gross. They have Trump trying to pronounce and read the names of the dead children while the NRA rings a bell. Disgusting. pic.twitter.com/AADaVc4o0s

— Ron Filipkowski (@RonFilipkowski) May 27, 2022

And yes, Trump did do a stupid little jig, which you see here.

Acosta: Just a few days after the massacre, we saw Donald Trump dancing on stage l
Journey: I was there. He was not dancing
Acosta: We’re showing it right now
Journey: At the beginning of his speech, he did do a very memorable memorial for the victims pic.twitter.com/Grj2CHwj0W

— Acyn (@Acyn) May 29, 2022

The NRA has blithely held conventions right after mass shootings, apparently not caring about the public’s perception in the aftermath of such tragedies. The organization did this in 1999, just 10 days after the horrific massacre at Columbine High School, Colorado, holding a convention in Denver just 15 miles from the tragedy where 13 people lost their lives.

While the NRA earns the bulk of its funding from member donations, it’s worth noting that at least some of that funding also comes from arms manufacturers, CNN reports. According to the Violence Policy Center, an organization dedicated to gun control, from 2005 to 2013 the firearms industry “donated between $19.2 million and $60.2 million.” It should be noted that gun retailers are also included in this list.

As long as the NRA continues to benefit from donors, gun manufacturers, and retailers and uses that money to toss at politicians, nothing is going to change.

You might think campaign finance reform could help stem the flow of money from the NRA to the politicians it supports, and you’d be right, but this organization loves to violate campaign finance laws. It’s done that for years and was sued in November 2021 by the gun control advocacy group Giffords (founded by former Arizona Congresswoman Gabby Giffords), Reuters reports.

“The powerful gun lobby made as much as $35 million in ‘unlawful’ and ‘unreported in-kind campaign contributions,’ to seven federal candidates , including candidates for U.S. Senate in 2014, 2016, and 2018, and Donald Trump’s 2016 presidential campaign, according to the allegations.”

I’ve tried to check the status of this lawsuit but have so far been unsuccessful. All I know is that the endless circle of money involved will continue to be soaked in blood as long as it’s used to fund politicians and their campaigns.

I’ve included a clip of the Acosta/Journey dustup below.